…you have long, straight hair clipped back by a barrette.
…you own a long, denim skirt.
…you have ever had a quilted Bible cover with handles.
…you’ve never worn heels higher than 1 1/2 inches.
…you don’t see the need to wear makeup.
…the only young women’s magazine you’ve ever subscribed to is Brio.
…you volunteer in the church nursery/teach Sunday school to toddlers.
…you love heartwarming Hallmark movies, the Anne of Green Gables movie, and the 1995 BBC version of Pride and Prejudice.
…you’ve ever loved a Janette Oke novel.
…you memorized a raft of Bible verses to earn a scholarship for Christian summer camp.
…you have pledged to have your first kiss on your wedding day.
…you wear a Wordless Bracelet when none of the popular kids do.
…you bought a T-shirt at a Point of Grace concert.
…Elisabeth Elliot, Shaunti Feldhahn, and Stasi Eldredge are some of your favorite authors.
…your first celebrity crush was Michael W. Smith or Steven Curtis Chapman.
…the only social topic that gets you more fired up than abortion is evolution.
…you feel uncomfortable in shirts without sleeves.
Haley's Halo 
There’s nothing wrong with beta church girls…in fact, I’d take them over alpha girls any day.
…and you want to have at least 5 children. (You volunteer in the church nursery/Sunday school to practice for your future career as a mom, of course!)
All of these points are irrelevant, because the alpha/beta distinction doesn’t apply to women.
Women: either attractive or not attractive.
If you’re pretty, slim, kind, generous, and a good conversationalist and good cook, you can have all of those traits listed above, and men won’t care. At all.
Oh, and young.
I laughed out loud here…as a former reader of Breakaway.
Uh…Exactly how many of these have to apply to me before I must consider myself one?
HAHAHA!! I love this! I think serving in a childcare during church only served as a bigger form of birth control than I could have ever imagined!
Oh and the commenter Josh is a bit of a douche.
Douchey or no, I’m sort of with Josh. What does it mean for a girl to be a “beta”? In the case of a guy, it means that he is a loser in Roissy/Haley land (and won’t get a date with Haley, I guess). But what does it mean for a girl? She won’t get a date with Roissy? (Lucky girl.) She won’t get a date with anyone? That’s not true, because the items mentioned don’t have much bearing on whether guys want to date you. (Although not all Christian guys are going to continue with a girl who won’t go to first base.)
dragnet–
I always wondered if any guys actually subscribed to Breakaway.
Cane Caldo–
You own a long, denim skirt?
y81–
Beta girls can’t attract alphas or extract commitment from them. Also, I think that MOST single Christian men will dump a girl for refusing to kiss him prior to marriage, although some might be willing to wait until engagement. People around here complain that Christian women are too “of the world,” but I don’t see a whole lot of evidence that Christian men aren’t. Most Christian guys won’t refuse sex with their girlfriends if the girlfriends are willing.
She’s never touched a drop of alcohol and judges those who do.
HH: “Most Christian guys won’t refuse sex with their girlfriends if the girlfriends are willing.” Why should they?
landon–
Um…because they’re not married?
If that’s what she considers a bit of a douche, the commenter Kate must be on the hockey player hygiene schedule.
Haley, are you sure you are not describing a traditionalist girl? What’s missing from your description is what dalrock called “Having a clue”. A woman (me too old to date girls) who is like that and has a clue is extremely date-able.
Boy, have I seen THIS over and over again, my friend. Beta church girls: Vision Forum daughters.
Sorry Josh, it does apply to women.
“Elisabeth Elliot, Shaunti Feldhahn, and Stasi Eldredge are some of your favorite authors”
Ooh, the first and last are. But I have many more, and I’m not very submissive; fittingly, sicne both Elliot and Eledredge are toughies in fact.
I have a long denim skirt. That’s it!
Sadly I’m not good enough for the others (and had to google some of them). I suspect that I have had more success with boys than the beta church girl :(
Haley I know you like clothes, same one as this, I just googled to find it, I got it at a sample sale.
http://denimdaily.com/womens-jeans/claudia-schiffer-stella-mccartney-denim-skirt.html
I don’t think it’s very flattering though, I was on a 70s kick. I don’t know what I was thinking, even on Claudia Schiffer it it looks less Coke ad and more drink the koolaid at some communie.
“Sorry Josh, it does apply to women.”
Not really, Jen. You can’t really tell men what they should find attractive. A pretty face, great rack, long legs, and nice ass = alpha for girls.
“Boy, have I seen THIS over and over again, my friend. Beta church girls: Vision Forum daughters.”
If they’re hot, they’re hot. Even if they’re VF girls.
…you volunteer in the church nursery/teach Sunday school to toddlers.
Thats positive SMV from this man’s perspective.
I’m saying, Svar, that the traditional definitions of alpha and beta work for female personalities too.
“Even if they’re VF girls”
Which is why you have to look beyond your penis at long-term consequences.
“If you’re pretty, slim, kind, generous, and a good conversationalist and good cook, you can have all of those traits listed above, and men won’t care. At all”
That’s very sweet, but you do need to look at her core beliefs. I promise, it will ultimately affect things.
“I’m saying, Svar, that the traditional definitions of alpha and beta work for female personalities too.”
They don’t.
Yes, they actually do. People may not use them in SMP terms, but the personalities themselves are present in women as well.
I don’t see it. Alpha and beta talk about explicitly male behaviours. But even if women do have these behaviors, what difference does it make if it has no bearing on their SMP values?
Because there’s more to life than SMP; people’s personalities exist outside of it.
If you were to look at groups of girls, there can be clear distinguishments there. Even with Christian authors, there are; I hate the Greek terms used for people other than “alpha”, but if you’re roughly estimating a person’s social behavior, they can be helpful (I will say that the other terms, like gamma and omega, don’t really apply to women). Elizabeth George is more of a beta, while Martha Peace would be an alpha-type.
If you were to look at groups of girls, there can be clear distinguishments there. Even with Christian authors, there are; I hate the Greek terms used for people other than “alpha”, but if you’re roughly estimating a person’s social behavior, they can be helpful (I will say that the other terms, like gamma and omega, don’t really apply to women). Elizabeth George is more of a beta, while Martha Peace would be an alpha-type. – Jen
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Jen – I respectfully disagree that there really is no such thing as a female ‘alpha’, at least compared to what it’s male counterpart represents in nature – and in God’s creation.
In other words, ‘beautiful’ females, and their roles and expectations in life, are in no way similar or compatible to what a male of the same social caliber or standing has to go through. Basically, for a male to be considered ‘alpha’, or at least socially dominant, he has to constantly prove himself to others, especially his immediate peer group, and most especially the females in his peer group that he is the ‘genuine article’. No such equivelance exists for the ‘beautiful’ ladies – they merely just have to ‘show up’ and people, men and women alike – will recognize where they stand in the female pecking order and overall social hierarchy.
Incidentally – I, most especially as a Christian, do not particularly like or agree with this unfortunate design of Our species; however, we still have to recognize the truth in the matter, that it is part of mankind’s sinful nature that we as Christians are to overcome – so as to seek and find the inner spiritual beaty and character in our fellow Christians – whatever their rank or station in life – or whatever they may look like.
I’m just goinbg by what I see-there are clearly many women with leadership qualities, just as there are men. This has been proven throughout history, even if they don’t match men in every way.
No, I didn’t mean in general social terms, that an alpha female has to act the same way as a male one :) I don’t know if beautiful women alione have the status you speak of, though; a certain kind of active personality is generally needed too. Funny, I was speaking of a different kind of alpha altogether from that of the SMP.
Oh yes and I meant to say this is perfectly said: “we still have to recognize the truth in the matter, that it is part of mankind’s sinful nature that we as Christians are to overcome – so as to seek and find the inner spiritual beaty and character in our fellow Christians – whatever their rank or station in life – or whatever they may look like.”
@ Langobard
Good points. I just don’t see how alpha or beta can apply to women. Also, I appreciated your point about how men have to continually prove himself. Yukio Mishima, thinker of the Japanese Right, once said that manhood is a constant battle, fought everyday, but that womanhood is static-a woman is always a woman, no matter what. That’s not a direct quote but a paraphrase.
I’m just goinbg by what I see-there are clearly many women with leadership qualities, just as there are men. This has been proven throughout history, even if they don’t match men in every way.
Hi Jen (I meant to comment sooner on this interesting subject, but was away for the weekend).
Yes, there are absolutely a fair number of women with leadership qualities very similar to that of men.
I just meant, however, that it really does not do for them the same thing in an SMP sense, that it does for men, i.e. – translate into dating, mating and, most importantly, reproductive ‘success’ – the reason being that traits such as dominance and aggressiveness, and basically any form risk-taking in general has been, and realistically still is, highly frowned upon when a woman does it, but is absolutely lauded and often celebrated (of course within reason and cultural-specific) when males engage in this type of behavior.
The most fundamental reason for this, of course, is that women give birth, hence the power of a female, ‘alpha’ (in an equivicol sense, of course) is within their womb, and any form of risk-taking is ultimately dangerous, and potentially ultimately detrimental, for them to carry out this highly important function for the continuation of the culture, and the civilization of the People, Tribe or Nation.
No, I didn’t mean in general social terms, that an alpha female has to act the same way as a male one :) I don’t know if beautiful women alione have the status you speak of, though; a certain kind of active personality is generally needed too. Funny, I was speaking of a different kind of alpha altogether from that of the SMP.
Well, a woman’s ‘status’, in the SMP sense, is basically on how physically attractive she is, along with, of course, how relatively young she is, since this translates into how fertile she potentially is to her ‘suitor’.
As I mentioned above, a woman engaging in risky or risk-taking behaviors is assumed, justifiably or not, in jeopardizing herself and, most importantly, her fertility value to her suitor, and to her Tribe/People in general.
Oh yes and I meant to say this is perfectly said: “we still have to recognize the truth in the matter, that it is part of mankind’s sinful nature that we as Christians are to overcome – so as to seek and find the inner spiritual beaty and character in our fellow Christians – whatever their rank or station in life – or whatever they may look like.”
Thanks Jen for reciprocating the sentiment.
I mean this very much: there is a lot about the hard facts and truths about life that I do not particularly like or agree with, however, as a ‘red-pill Christian’ (as I like to think of myself) I am commanded by the Lord to seek out and understand the Truth, however unpleasant it may be to me personally, so as to understand what our fallen natures are all about, and what it takes to overcome them and walk in the ways of Our Lord – since, like you so richly and poignantly say, a person’s true and real beauty and character lies within them, not without – and certainly not without Our Lord Jesus.
@ Langobard
Good points. I just don’t see how alpha or beta can apply to women. Also, I appreciated your point about how men have to continually prove himself. Yukio Mishima, thinker of the Japanese Right, once said that manhood is a constant battle, fought everyday, but that womanhood is static-a woman is always a woman, no matter what. That’s not a direct quote but a paraphrase.
Thanks buddy.
Yes, Mishima, I recall him from a college class – thanks for the reminder!
I am going to comment more on this subject, and I invite our esteemed bloghost Haley to do a whole seperate thread on this subject: that of what is interpreted to be ‘alpha-beta’ behaviors, particularly for Christian men, particularly how our fellow brothers and sisters here on this site on this issue here at the home of Haley’s Halo.
particularly how our fellow brothers and sisters here on this site on this issue here at the home of Haley’s Halo.
Rambling sentence, sorry.
What I meant to say is how our fellow brothers and sisters on this site feel about and interpret what is ‘alpha’ and ‘beta’ behavior, particularly on the part of a Christian man.
I hate the Greek terms used for people other than “alpha”
In terms of SMV, the terms translate as follows:
alpha = attractive
beta = less attractive
omega = unattractive/repulsive
The Man Who Was Thursday, Alkibiades of the now defunct blog Seasons of Tumult and Discord in response to Vox Day’s overly complex taxonomy of male hierarchy and behaviors described “Alpha” as behaviors that peak sexual interest but do not cause relationship comfort, “Beta” as behaviors that cause relationship comfort but not sexual attraction, and “Omega” as behaviors that cause neither and flat out repulse women.
I hate the Greek terms used for people other than “alpha”
In terms of SMV, the terms translate as follows:
alpha = attractive
beta = less attractive
omega = unattractive/repulsive
…
The Man Who Was Thursday, Alkibiades of the now defunct blog Seasons of Tumult and Discord in response to Vox Day’s overly complex taxonomy of male hierarchy and behaviors described “Alpha” as behaviors that peak sexual interest but do not cause relationship comfort, “Beta” as behaviors that cause relationship comfort but not sexual attraction, and “Omega” as behaviors that cause neither and flat out repulse women.
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Yes gentleman – but I want to know what Christian ladies value in the men in their lives, or with male traits overall.
I know that the laws of the SMP broadly apply to all human being, Christians included, but I wish to hear from a fully self-actualized Christian lady who has, essentially, ‘overcome’ this world (as the Bible commands), and what she finds valuable/attractive/important in men, or at least in potential suitors generally.